Can we please just keep the preachers out of this? -- Last Chance Democracy Cafe
http://www.lastchancedemocracycafe.com/?p=1380

I lost my father a year-and-a-half ago at the ripe old age of 84. Although, as an aside, there’s no age that’s “ripe” enough when it’s your own father, is there?
For a good portion of his life, Dad was an active minister in the United Church of Christ. Eventually he grew weary of church politics, went back to school for his doctorate and became a sociology professor (where he then, of course, had to put up with academic politics, but that’s a different story). During the last 40 plus years of his life, while he remained an ordained minister and would on occasion fill in on a Sunday, he was never again a church pastor.
So I was a bit surprised when, during his final illness, it became obvious to me that while he was certainly proud of his years spent teaching, at the end of the day he considered himself first and foremost a minister of the United Church of Christ.
It was part of his essence.
And I’m pretty sure I know what Dad’s response would have been, were he still here, to the words of Jeremiah Wright and, per the latest dustup, Father Michael Pfleger: he would have dismissed the whole issue as stupid and insisted that what they say at the pulpit is between them and their congregations and denominations.
Simply put: it’s nobody else’s damn business.
And, no, Dad, though liberal, never said anything nearly as controversial as the now famous words of Rev. Wright or the increasingly famous words of Father Pfleger: his was a subtler approach.
He did, however, occasionally say things capable of causing a stir. One time, in the middle 1960s, for example, he offered a very mild comment on the Vietnam War during a sermon, causing our next door neighbor to storm out of the church in protest (they remained on friendly terms afterwards).
But most of the arguably controversial things — and there weren’t that many of them — Dad said from the pulpit were Scriptural in origin. The Christian faith, after all, has some fairly revolutionary beliefs — things right wing Bible-thumpers often try to ignore (although some are now doing better). Things, for example, having to do with the duty the materially comfortable owe to the poor.
There is very little in our current “greed is good” culture, after all, that can easily be squared with the teachings of Jesus Christ, whatever Rolex wearing televangelists may from time to time claim.
So speaking as a PK (preacher’s kid), let me let you in on a little secret. Getting under people’s skin — sometimes even saying “outrageous” things — is part of a minister’s job. Sermons are supposed to get people thinking, shake them up a little. They can be freewheeling, filled with spontaneous expression. On occasion they can even be over the top and offensive. The idea, of course, is to shake us out of our complacency.
Political correctness and preaching have very little in common.
Father Pfleger’s words about Hillary Clinton, to my ear at least, were, in fact, unfortunate and even offensive. But they were made during a religious service as part of a pastor’s attempt to make a point, whether we agree with it or not, about white attitudes of entitlement. It was not a stump speech made as part of a political campaign.
Pfleger himself is politically active, at least in the sense of being a community activist (where he has done many good things), but at the time he made the statements at issue he was preaching as a clergyman. If he went over the line in the small portion of his sermon that’s currently swimming across the Internet, that’s an issue between him and the congregation.
It’s a somewhat different story, of course, when a preacher, such as Rev. John Hagee, intentionally injects his faith into the political process by arguing that his religious visions or traditions should become the template for American political life. Where that’s true, those visions and traditions become fair game. But even then I wonder if we haven’t gone too far in the direction of flyspecking old sermons looking for something to use against a candidate associated with the pastor in question.
This is a road that will lead nowhere but to grief for both religion and public discourse in this nation. It needs to stop now.
THE LAST CHANCE DEMOCRACY CAFE
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Accountable for others' words and actions?
Never before - Never Again
Not the Medias fault
Keep all gods, magic, leprechauns, etc out of it
Religion vs. Politics
I could not agree more.
Let's keep the preachers out of this
Can we please just keep the preachers out of this?
Excuse Much - The Whiners Accuse US of Whining?
Yes - I'm recommending a column by a former Reagan speechwriter...published in a Murdoch-owned newspaper. That I am doing so should show you in just how much contempt most of the people you're counting on to vote for Hillary Clinton hold her in - and why....
pathetic
Citing Peggy Noonan ...
... on how REAL women leaders respond to sexism?
Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahah ......
It Proves, Yman, That Even a Stopped Clock is Right Twice a Day
Sure "Doc" ...
"Real" men support Obama's candidacy? Then why are YOU supporting him? And Clinton is a "hand-picked closet NeoKon Khrister Right gal"? Wow .... however did you manage to vote for her? How many times did you pull the lever for her? I mean ................ that's gotta make someone feel like a complete idiot!
Hey! Why not check with Phyllis Schlafly to see how "real" women leaders respond to sexism? Maybe Ann Coulter ...
Hahahahahahahahahahahhahahahahahahahahahahahah ...........
Can we please just keep the preachers out of this? Maybe Not
That's what I certainly think, PD
As for Father Pfleger? Well, I'm reminded of a line from some Indiana Jones knockoff movie where the hero, listening to the heroine threaten an army of villains with all the incredible things the hero has done to kill off his enemies in the past, moans softly, "I beg you NOT to help me...!"
Apparently we can't
Just wanted to say - this whole flap is stupid
No its Not
Issues Much, Tpagy?
Brother! The only GOOD thing about this election year is that the Rethugs are (finally!) at each others' throats just a bit worse than WE normally are! Though I'm sure that, being good Libburuls, we'll somehow manage (once again!) to squabble and "What About Me Me ME!?!?!?!?" so much that we'll boldly yank defeat from the jaws of victory....
No its Not
I hate to say this...
Well - actually, yeah....
I respectfully disagree..
The righteous b.s. preached by clergymen/snake oil salesmen of all faiths is the very reason most people -including myself -have stopped going to church and will likely not be going back any time soon.
It's easy for whites to both snicker and scream at what's said behind African American churches -because while it may be shocking, it's usually the stark truth of the matter and serves the public interest by revealing the secret inner thoughts of that community's mindset.
Because that's at the heart of the issue you raise - the truth. We certainly don't hear it from the media and the medai only allows those voices it wants heard.
So, if it takes youtube to reveal to the public a truth that the public should know, and who can then decide for themselves the next course of action to take - then I say VIVA YOUTUBE.
While white clergymen prefer to hide their own immoral thoughts and conduct by continually beating everyone else down for their failings, and then once down in the dirt promise to relieve the sinners of their sins for a monthy tithe their flock can hardly afford.
Look at this favorite BILLIONAIRE from the white community's church and tell me we need to keep this guy hidden from the public:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V1Jik5ZbWjQ
No, we need more light into every church, whether Jewish or Muslim , Baptist or Presbyterian. We need to rout out guys like this.
Of the few decent clergyman around today, I'd be in church right now if there was a nearby service and the preacher was Joel Osteen.
He preaches something of what Obamas also does - an uplifting - you can do it - I'll be at your side - kind of attitude that invigorates and encourages us all to bigger and better places.
Nationalism is not terrorism. And an adversary is not an enemy.