It's the 3:10 to Minneapolis for Republicans, But Playtime for Democrats
THE FIFTH COLUMNIST by P.M. Carpenter
Three-ring circuses are so 20th century. These days our attention is directed to a much vaster arena of diversionary political spectacles -- big states vs. small ponds, important constituencies vs. negligible ones, blissful primaries vs. abhorrent caucuses, genteel vilification vs. monstrous impropriety, permissible resume padding vs. real inexperience, etc. etc. and soon, if we're not careful, something as unimaginably absurd as the meaning of is vs. is -- and each success only encourages the barkers to add yet another ring.
Actually it's more daycare center than circus; but what the hell, it distracts from petty nuisances like buffoonish foreign wars and coming soup lines, and of course nothing thrills or grabs attention like victimhood -- He started it.
And naturally with toddlers there's always the problem of rules -- laying them out, making sure everyone understands them, and encouraging the mature following thereof. But there's always one in the room with budding lawyerly instincts and a nose for exceptionalism, for special dispensation from Hoyle. Yeah, those were the rules all right, but the prepubescent's losing proves beyond any reasonable doubt that they just weren't fair.
Hence ...
"Party leaders and the rival campaigns," reports the New York Times, "started searching in earnest on Thursday for a way to seat barred delegations from Florida and Michigan." Yet "they remained deeply divided over how to do so ... [and] much remains to be settled."
That's likely because the plastic tippy cup of toddler earnestness isn't exactly overflowing these days.
Some hold positions that are critically reasoned -- not that reason plays a part in this romper-room imbroglio any longer -- if not entirely dug in.
Party chairman Howard Dean, for example, has bellowed in frustration that, in effect, it's not his department. It's that of the cranky and incorrigible states and their object of affection, so, instructs Howard, take a hike and try rereading the rulebook while you're at it.
"You can’t change the rules in the middle of the game," he protested on NBC’s "Today" show. But he knows you can; persistent whining pays, and every adult has his breaking point.
And of course there's poor Obama, futilely begging that we all just get along: "I’ll leave it up to the Democratic National Committee to make a decision about how to resolve it," he told ABC News in an impressive display of behaving beyond his playmates' political age. And, he added, "I certainly want to make sure that we’ve got Michigan and Florida delegates at the convention in some fashion." Did you hear the creaking?
Obama camp counselor Bill Burton was a bit sterner, but not by much. "Our campaign will support whatever the DNC rules are, including a fair remedy to this problem" -- meaning this fair and balanced fait accompli.
"However, allowing Sen. Clinton to change the rules and award her the nonexistent delegates when there was no campaign in the state is not the answer." Ah, Sir, your reasoning is formidable indeed, but it fails to confront the emotional power of a sustained, flat-out tantrum.
The one amusing aspect of actually seating these nonexistent delegates, however, is that the bleating victim of the otherwise manufactured unfairness would still come up short. "If the results of the two [unheld] primaries are allowed to stand and Mr. Obama is awarded the delegates won by 'uncommitted' on the Michigan ballot, Mrs. Clinton would pick up 64 delegates ... according to calculations by her campaign. [An Obama spokeman] said he believed Mrs. Clinton’s net advantage would be slightly smaller." But by either account, not enough to take the lead.
One fair remedy to the intolerable existing fairness is that in exchange for seating nonexistent delegates, everyone agrees that the supers simply side with the simple majority of the pledged ones. But naturally that's even more intolerable, since it would yield the winner who actually won.
Meanwhile in Michigan this week one other proposal was nearing dangerous harmony and grown-up consensus, thus the Clinton-siding governor scrapped it as being problematically "insurmountable." Said one negotiator of unfashionable, old-school earnestness: "That took the oxygen out of the room."
But it was in Florida that Senator Bill Nelson, a cheerless and manifestly clueless Clinton backer, unintentionally pronounced the probable object of this goalpost-forever-moving game: "If we don’t do anything, we’re looking at a train wreck."
Senator, a lot of people are beginning to think that's precisely what your candidate seeks. It's her choo-choo and she'll wreck it however she wants.
Please respond to the commentary by leaving comments below and sharing them with the BuzzFlash community. For personal questions or comments you can contact P.M. at
fifthcolumnistmail@gmail.comTHE FIFTH COLUMNIST by P.M. Carpenter
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Hillary sucks worse than Monica
Michigan and Florida have to count
Based on the present primary results? No – particularly Michigan, where only Hillary Clinton was on the ballot. But to argue that the voters of Michigan and Florida should be punished for “violating the rules” is undemocratic and, in practical terms, just creates bigger problems.
“They violated the rules, so don’t come whining now” – Sounds good, except for a couple of things. First, it wasn’t the Fla. democratic primary voters who moved the primary date – it was the republican state legislature and Gov. Crist (R) http://thehill.com/campaign-2008/florida-legislature-throws-wrench-into-primary-season-2007-05-03.html . So, punish the Fla. democratic primary voters because their republican legislature and Gov. moved the date? Seems pretty undemocratic, huh?
“We need to stick to the rules!” Makes sense - but as Howard Dean pointed out a couple of days ago, ( http://www.buzzflash.com/articles/alerts/336 ) the party rules also provide that, instead of discounting the votes altogether, those states can appeal to the Convention Credentials Committee, who would decide whether to seat them, or they can have a “re-do” of some form in those states. So if you to “stick to the rules,” you’d better be prepared for the possibility that the committee could seat the delegates. Good idea? No. There would be an all-out war over the apportionment of those delegates. A “re-do”? Makes a lot more sense, although it will cost a lot of $$ and some people on both sides will continue to bitch and moan. But it’s a hell of a lot better than ignoring over 2 million democratic primary voters.
Political suicide – The last problem created by ignoring these votes is practical. Frankly, to ignore these votes would be political suicide. Florida and Michigan are key battleground states with a lot of electoral votes. To tell the Fla. voters they will have no say in the choice of their candidate because their republican legislature and gov. moved up the primary date will demoralize and anger a lot of voters. Will many still turn out in November? Sure. But a lot won’t. The democratic candidate cannot afford to write off those states. “If two of the most important states in the country are not seated at the convention, it has incredible implications for the Democrats in November, and the Republicans will use it against us,” said Tad Devine, a former member of the DNC Rules and Bylaws Committee who is not aligned with any campaign. http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0308/8869_Page2.html .
You may not like it, but something has to be done about the Florida/Michigan mess.
Unspinning
First to unspin the spin:
Almost all the Democratic lawmakers in Florida locked hands with the Repugnicans in defying the Democratic National Committee's rule despite the party's warnings. The Florida Democrats (a.k.a. Republic-rats) provided the Republicans political cover for this Rovian maneuver (much like Liebman and Hilliary provided Bush in voting him the authority to invade Iraq).
Second, a redo vote would be an acceptable solution -- although, two days ago, Clinton said this was not acceptable.
But the cost of a redo vote should come out of the state Democratic Parties' pockets, because they are the ones most responsible for this mess.
Oh, yes, you can blame the Repugnicans of Florida, but we expect them to try to screw us. We'd be better off letting our Democratic leaders know that, if they don't stand and vote for us, we will make them pay for their craven conduct.
No spinning ...
Yes - many of the democratic legislators voted to pass the bill - but this doesn't make them "Republic-rats", as you so eloquently put it. Many of them were relieved to finally get something they had spent years fighting for - paper ballot machines to replace the flawed optical machines that were being used in the Florida elections. Apart from that, even if they had unanimously opposed the bill, it was obvious they could not have defeated it. The bill had unanimous suppport from Gov. Crist (R) and a legislature that was dominated (2-to-1) by republicans. So even if they were willing to sacrifice the paper ballot machines, the bill would have been pushed through by republicans.
Beyond that, even if the legislature and gov. were 100% dems, the point remains. The 1.7 million democratic primary voters of Florida and the 328,000 voters in Michigan should not be "punished" for a dispute between the DNC and the state party leaders in those states. To do so would be political suicide. More importantly, it's undemocratic.
BTW - I don't know what HC's position is on the issue, but it looks like they're open to it. ""Let's let all of the voters go again if they are willing to do it," Clinton adviser Terry McAuliffe said Tuesday night on MSNBC. "Whatever we have to do to get people in the system, let's do it."
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/03/05/AR2008030502745.html
Elect Hillary Clinton Even Though She's For Staying The Course?
Right, no matter
No matter? Right. Just vacuum between the ears.
It's official
Well, it's now official. Bush's Brain is now a McCain advisor:
"Karl Rove, the president’s top political hand since his Texas days, recently gave money to McCain and soon after had a private conversation with the senator. A top McCain adviser said both Mehlman and Rove are now informally advising the campaign. Rove refused to detail his conversation with McCain."
http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0308/8911.html
What remains unconfirmed is whether Rove is also advising Hilliary Clinton.
We really shouldn't jump to conclusions, because appearances can be deceiving, no matter how strong an association appears.
Yet, it is interesting to speculate that Rove may be hedging his bets for the possibility of ever having to answer for his crimes. Bush won't pardon him in the absence of criminal charges, and Rove has only nine more months of Bush protection. After that, he's a sitting duck for ambitious prosecutors wishing to launch a political career by nailing the the second-most famous political crook in American history.
Bush's Brain is far too clever and devious not to take advantage of every opportunity in front of him. By helping to put either another Repugnican like McCain or a Republicrat like Hillary in the White House, he is not likely to ever answer for his crimes.
Hillary has made it clear that she is no less ambitious and no more scrupled than Bush's Brain. The question remains whether American voters have the brains to vote against such unbridled corruption and tyranny.
"Whether American Voters Have the Brains. . ."
Please, just this once
I know, Commonsense, my friend. I'm all too aware how much common sense is an oxymoron.
Yet, during times like these, when cynicism appears to be the only sane approach to life, I think of Abraham Lincoln's life and struggles, during a far worse time than these, and of what he said:
"You can fool all of the people some of the time, and some of the people all of the time, but you can't fool all of the people all of the time."
I'm clinging to hope that just this once in a long, long, long time, enough Americans will get tired of playing the fool.
This is getting lame.....
Puzzle solved
"My current puzzler is how people still rally behind her wall of crap?"
Clearly, they enjoy the smell.
Stick to "monster" and drop the "bitch". Only Republicans like McCain are comfortable with people calling her "bitch." "Monster" is gender neutral. (Although even that word can get you you thrown out of polite progressive circles, as just happened to Samantha Power.)
Poor Obama, he's just not getting it. Instead of sacking Samantha, he should have just chastised her and said, "No, no, no. Hilliary is not a monster, as far as I know." What's good for the shrew should be good for the gander.
But I don't hang around in polite progressive circles: Hillary is a monster of Godzillian proportions. If the Japanese are smart, they'll ban her from Tokyo.
Askolnick, why
HUH?!
"aren't we blogging together against McCain today?"
Huh?! Did I miss something in P.M.'s commentary?
P.M.'s column above does not mention McCain even once. It's entirely about how pathetically the Democratic leadership is responding to Clinton's tantrums and threats to tear the party apart if she doesn't get her way.
And I don't think BuzzFlash is the best place to go after McCain at this point. Nothing we can do or say can stop him from being nominated, since he is the nominee. What we now have to do is stop him from winning - or more likely stealing - the Presidency.
The only possible way to do that would be to nominate a candidate who can oppose and defeat him - not one who is praising McCain as the second-best Presidential candidate after her.
We need to do that without letting Hillary tear the party apart, which is exactly what she's doing. There's no better words to describe her actions than blackmail and extortion. Everyone knows she cannot possibly end up with more elected delegates than Obama. So she is threatening the party leadership in one clear message after another: Either commit the super delegates to her or she will destroy all chances the Party has of defeating McCain.
Democratic leaders better stop her NOW before she causes more irreparable harm. She already provided McCain with a video for his own campaign ads, including her praise of McCain as being the better, safer choice for Commander in Chief than Obama.
Only a monster would do such damage to her own party.
She has all but endorsed the Republican nominee for Commander in Chief -- should she not get the Democratic nomination.
In doing so, Clinton has told her party, "Now you have to give me the nomination unless you want my public statements being used to eviscerate the Democratic nominee in November." And she has warned them to act quickly before she provides Repugnicans with more clubs to use against Democrats.
Only a monster would do that to her Party -- and the millions of Americans who belong and support the Party.
This monster has got to be stopped and stopped before she does more irreparable harm. Democrats have a long and inglorious history of cravenous. Either they stand up to such corruption and tyranny now or they will become a "show party," like they now have in Russia to give the facade of democratic government.
Back At You
I wish we were able to focus on ol' hot head
But we can't, as long as Hilliary Clinton is providing him cover - as well as endorsing him over Obama.
First, we must drive the monster away. And we're not going to do that by saying, "Oh, gee, why can't we all just get along?"
For monsters like Hilliary and Rove, pleas like this are music to their ears, as they dance and stomp on everyone in their way.
Vampires require a wooden stake, were-wolves a silver bullet.
In the case of demon-possession of the Democratic Party, we need to keep chanting an effective spell to rid ourselves of the monster.
Here's one:
"Out, out damn Hillary! Will not all the perfumes of the Orient rid this Party of the Rovian stench of Hell?"
Sorry, I just can't get Shakespeare's Macbeth out of my mind. I wonder why that is.
"Just Waiting for Obama"
Except, Clinton won't win.
What
High Road, Losing Road
Florida
Reality check, Bill
First of all Bill, the decision to "disenfranchise" Democratic primary voters in Michigan and Florida was forced by the political leaders in Michigan and Florida. They chose to deprive their members of a vote in the candidate selection process by defying the Party's rules.
Michigan and Florida state party leaders were warned not to move their primaries up or their delegates would not be recognized by the National Party. The state party leaders went ahead and dared the National Party to enforce its rules.
Second, no voters in Florida and Michigan were "disenfrancised." You're parroting one of Clinton's silliest lies.
Americans have the inalienable right to vote in all government elections, provided they meet a number of specified rules (ie. being at least 18 years of age, having citizenship, legal residency, etc.)
However, Americans do NOT have a right to vote in party primaries and caucuses -- unless they meet the rules for eligibility established by the party in each state.
As in nearly half of our states, Florida's Democratic Party does not allow Republicans and independents to vote in its primary. To claim that people in these states are "disenfranchised" by party rules would be simple nonsense.
In the United States, political parties have the right to set the rules by which party members can select candidates to represent the party in general elections.
The state Democratic Parties of Florida and Michigan refused to abide by the Democratic Party's rules. As a result, they denied their own voters a chance to be counted.
To have their delegates recognized, state parties have to abide by their Party's rules.
What part of this do you not understand? Are rules only rules when they benefit Republicans, and those that act like one?
It would be self-destructive idiocy to put another stubborn, egotistical, rule-breaker like Bush into the White House.
If like me, you are dismayed by all the destruction a moron like Bush was able to accomplish in eight years, you should be trembling over the thought of how much more irreparable harm could be done by a rule-breaker as intelligent and corrupt as Hilliary.
Reality? When ...
did you start subscribing to reality? Good ta hear! I'm a little skeptical, given all your misstatements, but here we go:
"Michigan and Florida state party leaders were warned not to move their primaries up or their delegates would not be recognized by the National Party." - Askolnick
Oooops! Turns out that it was the republican-controlled Florida legislature and the republican gov. that moved the primary up, not the state party leaders.
http://thehill.com/campaign-2008/florida-legislature-throws-wrench-into-primary-season-2007-05-03.html
But if you want to argue that the votes of over 1.7 million Florida democratic voters should be ignored because of the republican legislature and gov., good luck with that!
"Second, no voters in Florida and Michigan were "disenfrancised." You're parroting one of Clinton's silliest lies." - Askolnick
It's a "lie"? Really? Because Florida voters have no constitutional right to participate in a primary, they can't be said to have been "disenfranchised"? That's odd because "disenfranchise" in general terms means "to deprive of a franchise, of a legal right, OR OF SOME PRIVILEGE OR IMMUNITY (emphasis added)." http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/disenfranchise
Ooooooops again.
Next .....
Florida
You're not mistaken
Tahoe, you're right that the Florida primary date was set by the Republican-controlled legislature, but the Democratic Rule violation was supported by Florida Democrats!
Nearly every Florida Democratic lawmaker joined the Republican majority in voting to defy the Democratic National Committee's rule.
In defying DNC's rules, Florida's Democratic leadership gave the Repugnican maneuver the appearance of bipartisan support. (As in Texas, Florida's Democratic Party often forgets on which side of the aisle to sit. Most of them think Progressive means a brand of canned soup.)
That's exactly what Hillary Clinton did in voting to allow Bush to invade and occupy Iraq. She and a some other Republicrats gave Bush the appearance of bipartisan support.
The question we're now faced with is who gets to control our party: Democratic progressives or Republicans and Republic-rat whores like Joe Lieberman and the Clintons? We still have a choice.
Don't bother ...
... using facts with Askolnick. The Clinton-hatred gene has overpowered any sense of reason.
Then What?
then what?
What to do?
what to do
Again you misrepresent the issues
Again Bill-O from CT, you misrepresent the issues. The Democrats are not saying "tough luck." They're saying what every political party is allowed to say by precedence and by law: You have to play by the party's rules.
If Florida and Michigan democrats want to get angry, they should get angry and punish the Republic-rat leaders who joined hands with state Republicans to hurt their fellow Democrats.
We need to vote every Republic-rat out of office. Once we do that, Republicans, who have always been a minority, will no longer be able to cause much harm. It's the Republicrats, like Liebermand and Clinton, who have allowed Bush and the Republicans to wreck this country. They've stolen our party and joined hands with the Repugnicans to share in the spoils.
Exaggeration? Hardly. Both Lieberman and Clinton say John McCain is better qualified for Commander in Chief than Obama.
Please stop and give this some serious thought: Lieberman and Clinton are saying McCain is better qualified to be our nation's Commander in Chief than Obama.
But what do many high level military officials think of McCain as Commander in Chief? They're shaking in their spit-polished boots over the thought of allowing that crazy hot head's hand on the nuclear button. This article in Salon is rather scary:
http://www.salon.com/news/feature/2008/03/06/commander_in_chief/
This is the guy that Hillary Clinton and Joe Lieberman have endorsed as better suited to be Commander in Chief than Barack Obama.
Can our choice for Democratic nominee now be any clearer?
For Republicrats, rule-breaking is the rule
Hey, Bill from CT, it's not Obama or his supporters who are opposed to YOUR solution of a do over. It's the Machiavellian monster you champion, who just two days ago rejected all do over plans. Clinton insists that the illegal delegates from Michigan and Florida be counted. Obama says he is NOT opposed to doing the vote over.
Did you forget this? Are you also refusing to remember how Clinton insisted that she didn't need to remove her name from the Michigan ballot (as Obama and Edwards did) because the votes will not be counted in selecting the party nominee?
And you're accusing Obama supporters, who agree to play by the rules, of "ripping the party apart"?
In the bizarro world of Clinton Republicrats, rule breaking is the rule, abiding by rules is "ripping the party apart."
My Clinton conundrum
A No Brainer