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Did the DNC Rules and Bylaws Committee protect the fair reflection of the voters?

So are you happy with Saturday's result of the DNC Rules and Bylaws Committee?

If you breathe out of your lungs, and you care about this issue, you probably aren't completely happy with the result.

If you felt like the DNC shouldn't have seated Michigan and Florida at all, then you weren't happy. If you wonder why the DNC broke their own rules and seated the two states, then you aren't happy.

If you felt like the Michigan Democratic Party's compromise was a violation of the fair reflection of the voters, then you weren't happy.

Then again, you might be satisfied to go on and forget this nightmare ever happened. But some words before we close this chapter. (And as always, this reflects my own personal view and not that of BuzzFlash management.)

I have criticized the DNC rule of taking away all the delegates as being unreasonable. I preferred the RNC rule of taking away half the delegates, which is, of course, exactly what the DNC committee ruled on Saturday. But I have also criticized the rule because it was apparent that the DNC was never going to apply the rule in this fashion. One of the reasons the states called their bluff is that they knew the DNC would have to seat the states in some form. It is good to have rules and to follow them, but rules aren't effective if ultimately you know the penalty won't stick.

But if the rules were the only issue, and would have been the only issue before the DNC Rules and Bylaws Committee on Saturday, then I might be happy right now. But I'm not.

My main issue with the Michigan and Florida issue hasn't really been the rules, but the side agreements. As several people pointed out on Saturday, the DNC wasn't a party to the side agreements. The side agreements from Iowa, New Hampshire, South Carolina, and Nevada were designed to further penalize Michigan and Florida beyond the DNC rules. The candidates did sign the side agreements, but it's difficult to say they signed them willingly since they wanted to curry favor with the four states.

Former Michigan Governor Jim Blanchard, speaking for the Clinton campaign on Saturday, pointed out that the side agreements didn't require candidates to remove their names from the ballot. If that isn't true, no one has objected so far. [Disclosure: Blanchard was my governor when I lived in Michigan.]

Sen. Barack Obama, Sen. John Edwards, Sen. Joe Biden, and Gov. Bill Richardson did remove their names from the Michigan ballot. Rep. Dennis Kucinich did try to remove his name, but was unable to do so. Gov. Blanchard on Saturday did say if there was one thing that would change, it would be changing the law to not allow candidates to remove their names from the ballot.

The side agreements set up significant additional penalties against the two states: no campaigning, no buying of ad time. But the side agreements came about because the DNC rule took away all the delegates, leading to numerous people saying "these states won't count."

But since Michigan and Florida would have appealed the decision, even without the Obama/Clinton close race we saw, it was way too soon to say "these states won't count." And as it turns out, those states now do count.

So was the 69-59 compromise by the Michigan Democratic Party a fair compromise or a flawed compromise?

The original premise of the compromise was that it was halfway in between the vote from January 15 (Clinton 73, Uncommitted 55) and the Obama campaign proposal (Clinton 64, Uncommitted 64). The 69-59 figures (rounded) were meeting the two sides halfway.

Gov. Blanchard, again speaking for the Clinton campaign, did point out that "as a practical matter, it is probably fair to say that almost all, if not all, of the uncommitted will be delegates for Sen. Barack Obama." Blanchard did point out that the Clinton campaign has worked hard to not be involved in selecting the Uncommitted delegates.

Gov. Blanchard pointed out that there was an organized, vigorous "uncommitted" campaign. He also mentioned that Obama, Edwards, and Richardson had joint handbills urging voters to vote "uncommitted." But for the 30,000 and perhaps others who would have loved to write-in a candidate, they were at the mercy of the Michigan rules and the candidates who didn't file the paperwork to have those write-in votes counted. Candidates who removed their names from the ballot would have needed to file additional paperwork to have any write-in votes counted.

What was fascinating was that Mark Brewer, chairman of the Michigan Democratic Party, offered extensive figures to back up the compromise. There were about 594,000 votes, not counting 30,000 write-in votes.

The 69-59 compromise is 3% of the vote, even though Brewer cited the 30,000 write-in votes (5%) and a 9% drop for Clinton in the exit polls. That is a heck of a lot more than 3%, so perhaps the number was tabulated based on a compromise between the January 15 primary and the Obama camp's split of the vote 50-50.

But does the 69-59 vote truly reflect the Michigan voters? For those who want to end this nightmare, you could justify the compromise as reflecting some of the write-in votes. But understand that there are going to be voters in Michigan who do feel like their votes were switched from what they voted in the voting booth, and that is a difficult pill to swallow.

Regardless of whether you support Obama or Clinton, regardless of how you think the vote will be impacted in Michigan and Florida in November, the Democratic Party should not be in this predicament of changing votes. The DNC rules weren't the problem; the side agreements truly made this mess. After all, Florida wasn't as much of an issue since all the names were on the ballot.

Iowa and New Hampshire have a lot of power; South Carolina and Nevada are getting their first taste of this power. And with the side agreements, we clearly have seen abuse of power from these states. There will be a new way in 2012 - it would be nice if the voters had the power to make sure their votes count.


A Royal Headache Put to Rest

The Florida/Michigan headache has finally been put to rest. Am I happy with the outcome? I think given the choices, it was the best one which would at least satisfy everyone in some part. Hillary and Obama both get some delegates, both states can be represented at the convention, and the voters of each state can feel like they were "counted" for the most part. It was a terrible situation for the party to find themselves in and I think the end result was fair and evenhanded. However, I must say that I'm annoyed that it happened in the first place. Our whole election process is rediculious - from campaigning 1 1/2 years before the election, to electronic voting machines which don't accurately record the votes, to allowing a REPUBLICAN state House decide the rules which govern the democratic party to having to rely on PAC money just to run for office! Then, to wrap up the whole package with a bow, our media outlets don't supply us with information about the candidates that help us make a decision. Instead, we're told about who spent more for a haircut, who has a "bad" minister, etc. We really DO need a revamp of our entire political process.

Michighan & Florida

I agree whole heartedly with Sandy 42. I think the DNC and the leaders in the Democratic Party have given Hillary Clinton the shaft. They have tried to shut down the voting since Obama won South Carolina & Iowa. I have voted as a Democrat since I began voting in 1972 but I will not support a candidate that did not win this thing on the up and up. When the party tried to steal Hillary's momentum at every turn of this process that said it all for me. You want Obama as your nominee and you will have him but I for one will not vote for him. There is no way to prove those uncommitted votes in Michighan were cast for Obama but you gave them to him anyway and Obama's supporters at the committee meeting kept calling Florida's primary flawed. The only flaw for you people is that Hillary won it and Obama didn't. Then to add insult to injury Father Pfleger gets up in the pulpit and insults her and her supporters to boot and saying they feel they are entitled because they are white. I will not stand for intolerence of any kind and this just put it over the top for me. I will not support this Democratic candidate.

OK Leslie

If you don't vote for Obama and let McCain win, you must enlist in the military. Letting McCain will guarantees more Americans and Iraqis will be killed and maimed. That will be your responsibility, so put your body where your mouth is.

Funny how Bettysdad ,,,

... unequivocally and emphatically states he would NEVER vote for "Mrs. Bill Clinton", but demands that all her supporters vote for Obama - or else THEY'RE responsible for the blood of American soldiers and Iraqis. Yet if "Mrs. Bill Clinton" were the nominee, he would have no issue with "letting McCain win" by not supporting her.

Wow .... I guess hatred of all things Clinton is more important than all those soldiers and Iraqis he's so concerned about ...

BTW - Bettysdad - You'd be the first in line to enlist if Sen. Clinton was the nominee, right? Well, ya know ....... as a military writer ("Stars and Stripes"?) ............ somewhere safe.

I will not take

I will not take responsibility for something I did not support from the beginning. I went to peace vigils before the war. I wrote letters to the editor and anyone that would print it before the war. I never voted for Bush. Did you? I am not responsible for the sins of the world just because I do not vote for Obama and anyone that spouts this load of rubbish can take a flying leap. You people are ridiculous. I voted for the candidate that I supported and she did not win but I will not support a candidate that draws you nuts to him like bees to honey and your comment to me is living proof of that of which I speak. If I do not vote or if I vote for someone else that is my right as an American and I do not have to justify that with Obama's supporters the DNC or anyone else for that matter. Go back to Obama's bandwagon and join the crowd there. You are a wonderful lot.

No problem.

Obama had an insurmountable lead in every metric before the meeting, and he has an insurmountable lead in every metric now. The committee did nothing to change the will of the voters. Can we stop talking about Mrs. Bill Clinton already?

Sure it's a Problem!!!

bettysdad you said...."The committee did nothing to change the will of the voters. Can we stop talking about Mrs. Bill Clinton already?"

It will be a blessing not to hear you "talking" about Mrs. Bill Clinton. I just wonder who you
are going to direct your nasty vile Rhetoric on now. Judging from the personality you have projected here on Buzzflash I'm sure you will find someone.

It is very disappointing to see the DNC rule the way they did regarding Michigan. Michigan voted, wheither Obama kept his name on the ballot or did not, was his own choice. Some say he took his name off because he was over 20% behind Clinton in the Michigan poll.
The people in Michigan choose Clinton as their nominee, not Obama. And the Non-Committed vote in Michigan were not all for Barrack Obama, other canidates were on the ballot, including Chris Dodd, Joe Biden, John Edwards and more. They each recieved part of those votes that were labeled uncommitted in Michigan. The DNC’s own bylaws state, non-committed votes will stay registered under the parties rules as non-committed. If that is the rules as per the Democratic National Committe’s rule book then Hillary Rodham Clinton is the nominee.
Why is Mrs. Clinton being treated so unfairly by The Democratic Party? Two facts remain plain for all to see. 1) This is the first real race for a Presidental Nomination between a woman and a black or afro-american that has both as viable canidates. 2) Mrs. Clinton is being pushed aside basically because she is a woman and from the male side of the equation, the male population is scared to allow a female to run this country. That ladies and gentlemen is pure bull!. If Obama does win the nomination, I have paid to support democratic canidates in the past, both myself, my wife and our children have been democratic supporters, we won’t be anymore, after this outrageous criminal act by the DNC.

Why all the upset?

The Democratic Party and almost everybody else has been deliberately ignoring the skewed and unsecured voting in many parts of the nation since 2004.(This interview with Mark Crispin Miller might be of interest. http://media.putfile.com/MCM-on-Malloy---5-29-2008 )In Georgia it was 2002. And in the South, the Jim Crow laws have always been tilting the elections. Al Gore won the election in 2000 even with some millions of votes spoiled. But it took until late 2001 to prove it. Our corporate-controlled votes are now hacked, destroyed and blocked by the millions, almost entirely to the detriment of liberal and Democratic candidates. It's clear that most Americans, certainly most Democrats don't want to check it out and understand that their votes are being moved and deleted. They've been admonished to "get over it." Their leaders have been complicit. Congress refuses to pass legislation that would begin to try to secure aspects of this goshawful mess. We have no democratic republic until we go back to the future and re-establish paper ballots with securing public processes in place. Then too, we have to get the corporate interests out of buying the elections and the corporate-dominated main stream media broken apart so that we Americans can access the facts and listen to rational, fair debate, not spin, lies and gotchas with final control of the exit polls. The worst part is not that this has happened to our election systems but that it is systematically ignored. Most American voters seem to like staying in La La Land. It's so much easier. Pat Williams

Vote Apportionment

The voting process of the Democratic Party is the most screwed up mess I have ever seen. Why even hold a primary if you do not even intend to count the votes. What a total waste of money and votes. I am angry that votes for Hillary were give to Sen. Obama. At this point in time, I am planning to just write in a candidate of my choice. Why even think my vote counts if it can be given away to someone I do not want? There has been a lot of talk on C-Span about the "angry white-over 60 female voter." Well, here is one of them and I am furious. I will NOT be pushed into voting for someone I feel is not ready to lead this country.

See above.

Please see my reply to Leslie abovr.

Mich. and Florida

Dorothy Strinka There should have been a revote.

I STILL Would Have Preferred Both States Revote

This is one of those "compromises nobody likes" solutions - it's sort-of "fair" without being really fair to the people of either state, or either candidate.

I guess I understand that primary/caucus "do-overs" are expensive - but how much is your rank&file's goodwill worth?

Michigan and Florida

I think that the decision was more then fair especially given the fact that every voter and every candidate was aware that the VOTES WOULD NOT COUNT. I also think the DNC once again showed a lack of courage and strength by counting any primary votes or delegates. The most fair outcome would have been to seat 1/2 delegates at the convention and not count the primary at all. We need a stronger more convicted group of committee members and congress persons. They are all far too weak for me.

Florida & Mich solutions could have been better

The way to have done this best was to revote. The next best way would have been to apportion the delegates ratios from what we have learned about he demographic support for both candidates in all other states and apply that to Florida and Michigan demographics to get the proper ratios of delegates for each candidate. Radioguts

To Get Rolling

Viewing from Illinois, I understand and sympathize with all victims of this action. However, overall, I am satisfied from a compromised standpoint. Obama capitulated having the effect of "going around" the Hillary blockade and getting the show back on the road.

The Timing Schedule

According to what I heard on C-Span on Saturday, all states were allowed, and encouraged to make their case for moving into what Secretary Hermann called the "pre-window." To hold thier primary prior to Super-Tuesday. Twelve states made presentations to the DNC Rules & Bylaws Committee. Of those twelve, Nevada and South Carolina were chosen. Michagan made a presentation. Florida chose not to. We can hash and re-hash this --- 'til the cows come home. The plain and simple is, the committee met. A majority voted for the compromise plans that the state parties of both states had worked out. If Mr. Ickes rhetoric is any indication, Mrs. Clinton has reserved her right to go to the Credentials Committee, at the National Convention in August. By that time, the point will be moot. Senator Obama should have enough delegates to secure the nomination, by the end of this week. If Mrs. Clinton's sole purpose, for continuing her mis-leading advertisements about "popular vote", is the destruction of the Democratic Party, she will continue on her path of party destruction. If the purpose of those associated with the Clinton campaign is to win elections, especially the November election, she will graciously concede to the inevitable, before week's end. The decision was made on Saturday. Her Committee members put Country and Party before her campaign. Maybe she should follow their example.

Don't forget who changed the primary dates

In Florida, it was the REPUBLICAN controlled legislature who changed the primary date. The state democratic party had no control. I think this was on purpose -- to get the voters in the state pissed off at the national Dem party.

Had I known that my vote could have counted (even toward half the delegates) in the primary, I would have switched my party affiliation (I was registered with no party affiliation) to Dem.

As it was, I didn't bother, because it wasn't going to count.

So I resent the rules being changed mid-stream.